Subject: I hope ProTools Dies.

That or a sudden intense interest in customer service and affordabiity suddenly and miraculously take hold of the company.

I'd just like to see Pro Tools Free released for OS X. I really miss that one.

yeah i'm not running protools if i have to boot up in *gag* os9 to use it.

I liked Protools Free too, but it envolved destructive recording. To be honest Garageband is 1000 times better than protools free cause you can tweak your sound till your heart's content and it doesn't effect the original file (CoreAudio). Good luck to Apple, in my honest opinion Apple is one of the bravest companies around, questioning 'industry standard' programs capabilities. The next few years will see the result of the Jobs/Gates fight for quality!

Apple's World Beaters:-

iMac
iPod
(the future?)
Mac Mini
Garagband
Mac OS X

I'm sorry, but you're talkin' bollocks! I've been using ProTools LE for just over a year now and I think it's excellent. As for their support... I've never had a problem with them. They're very thorough in letting you know about hardware and software upgrades. And as for ProTools free... why should anyone expect DigiDesign to provide free software? I've used many Pro Applications in my work (Designer) and if they had anything as good as DigiDesign's support I'd be a happy man.

They did provide it but, like BBEdit Lite, the demo was so good that it didn't encourage anyone to buy anything.

COBOL - I thought you were a DP guy? why do you even bother with ProTools? They have to keep it expensive to seperate them from evryone else and to maintain their mistique of being the "industry standard". What can PT do that DP can't? Back in the day Difidesign (makers of PT) made great A/D convertors but they're software wasn't cutting edge. That's why most pros used Digidesign hardware with StudioVision software - the first program to integrate audio AND MIDI sequencing. The Beastie Boys and BECK and everyone else were running this combo. But now, everyone is making great hardware and great software and computers are so powerful now why would anyone without an unlimited budget bother with ProTools? But still, that's no reason to wish that PT dies. I think you need to channel some of your anger COBOL in more creative ways. I worry about you.

It's really odd just how bad ProTools is. I find it extremely counterintuative. It seems like they have not changed the interface at all over the years and they are now afraid to because it will confuse everyone.

I got a copy of ProTools LE with my Mbox but I think Cubase tops it in every way. It's much easier to use, the interface is not confusing, and free/cheap VSTs are way more common than RTAS.

Oh well, as long as PT is the industry standard it's going to be around.

The problem is with a lot of free and cheap VSTs is that they sound like free and cheap VSTs. You can get RTAS wrappers for VSTs and use them in ProTools if you're desperate.

Time to chime in here.. first off there are a lot of reasons why ProTools prevails.. it is a Post tool more than a MIDI / music package.. things like serial machine control and remote track arming are a necessity. Cubase is hardly a ProTools killer. ProTools is NOT destructive recording as someone previously posted, in fact it requires a fair amount of effort to completely delete tracks. Yes the learning curve is steep, but once you know it nothing is faster for cutting for TV Film. Yes the hardware isn't cheap, but you get what you pay for. And, yes it is the industry standard. But there is no other post tool that compares. Logic is trying to make ground in this area but all others are just composition tools. Like Apples and oranges.

protool free was a great idea. I ended up buying a 002 rack and have been pretty happy.When people say it is expensive, dont forget you get pretty reasonable input preamps and inteface.

Pro tools is definately NOT destructive recording unless you specifically make it so. Many protools users would like a Free version in OSX so they can mix without the hardware.

I used Pro Tools LE for awhile and, though I've switched to Logic Express, I have few complaints about the program itself. Once you get the hang of it...it's actually very good.

However...

The upgrade paths and hardware compatibility issues for DigiDesign products is idiotic. That's the #1 reason I quit. I know they give the software free with their hardware, but I'd rather pay for the software and be able to choose from a wider selection of hardware (ala Logic). And, now that I've gotten the hang of Logic Express, I actually enjoy working in it much more than I ever did in ProTools.

It's not a problem limited to DigiDesign...it's the parent company. Ask anyone who's ever dealt with Avid. I just hope they don't take M-Audio down that same path to hell.

LMAO

OK, let's take this back. My reply was to the original post - which I thought (perhaps incorrectly) was a completely blinkered, biased and partisan view of ProTools. Was I one sided - probably. Holier than thou? I'll leave that to your discretion.

I use ProTools LE, deal with it, I can't really comment on other software - and I usually don't. Hell, I don't even use garageband.

Now, affordability?
Logic Express is a nice lttle app. from what I've read about it and in the UK costs £199
You'll probably need some kind of interface with that so how about an Edirol UA-25 which would appear comaprable to the MBox and goes for about £169 at the Apple Store.
Total = £368

ProTools LE which now comes with MBox2
R.R.P £340

Now as for the merits of each application - i'll leave that to others. But I would hazard that they each have different stengths and weaknesses and each have different upgrade paths.
Yes - digidesign tie you in to their hardware, but the hardware is good, so I don't have a problem with that and their online support hasn't let me don yet. Upgrading and compatibility has never been a problem.

If people don't like ProTools they can buy something else but affordability shouldn't really be a problem - should it?

ProTools free? they are not gonna waste time and money writing that when most people will use garageband in iLife.

Now SHhhhhhhh. The great Pie has spoken.

8O

Shouldn't that be the great and POWERFUL Pie? :D

Probably :)

I have been using Pro Tools for about a month now, having just picked up an Mbox. For $349, I got the USB interface, the protools software, reason adapted, some great plug-ins (amplitube, tracks EQ, and Sampletank entry version are all excellent), and 2 free condensor mics. OUTSTANDING VALUE.

I originally just wanted to use the hardware with garageband, but quickly found that I had much more freedom working with it in ProTools - the sounds are better and there is less latency, plus ProTools just seems to allow so much more control over exactly what I want to do. Yes, there is a step learning curve, but once you get the hang of the software, it all clicks.

That said, I usually do a quick demo my songs in GB to finish the composition and arrangement, then reconstruct them in ProTools. It's a little time consuming that way, but I find that the quality I get out of PT is worth it, while the ease of GB to "craft" the song is also worth it.

Maybe one of these days I'll actually finish some stuff and put it up on the site - just gotta get a bass to finish the low end on a few songs. Should be coming soon.

I think protools is ok but to me logic is way better....Doc Holiday

Personally I am grateful that they have not continually changed how the GUI operates. I've been a Protools engineer for almost 10 years now, and there's little I needed to educate myself on as the software progressed, and all the new features were integrated into the existing GUI.

AFA there not being anything that does what PT does, I highly dissagree, there are tons of DAW apps that do what it does as good or better. PT's big one up is marketing. they got their foot in the door first, which made them the unnofficial standard of the industry. However studios running Logic, Cubase, DP and Tracktion are not uncommon, and it is not that difficult for them to exchange files.

AFA the quality of the hardware, unless you spend big bucks for HD, it's pretty ho-hum. There are tons of better quality ADDA out there, but PT insists on seeing it's own hardware. True you can use certain converters interfaces (ADAT, SPDIF and M-Powered with Le for instance) but you still have to have their hardware as well. the ulitmate in piracy protection.

Protools is here for a long, long time. What bugs me is their discontinuance of upgrade support for their hardware. Some 001 owners found themselves stuck at 6.4 less than a year after purchasing the unit new, with only an offer of exchange to the 002, which IMHO is a sidegrade. Who the hell decided putting sensitivity and phantom power switching on the back of a rack mount unit, and adding 2 more pres but not putting any pads on them was a good idea? Idiots, what's who. The design engineers obviously never actually used the interface.

Now I see this about to happen with the original M-box. I bet money that there will be no or very few releases of PTle 7 that it will be compatible with, and there will be a similiar exchange program for the M-box 2, which, IMHO is another sidegrade. Great it's got midi, but you can get a midi interface for a few bucks. You lose the insert points, and get IMHO lower quality preamps. It's still buss powered. It's still limited to 48k.

What us PT users have asked for repeatedly is a reasonable sized dongle so we can edit without the need to hook up or carry something the size of the M-box. we're never going to get it.

However, PT ain't going anywhere.....

I know its for MACs. but imma PC user, and own a MAC but id like to know if anyone has used the application for both, what are your opionions on PC over MAC or MAC over PC? im new at the music so send info on subject thanks.

once your fluent with pro tools... every thing else is inferior.. especially cubase